Nisha : jai radhe Krishna bindu ji, good morning

bindu: Namaste nishu.

We will talk about The Astral World. 1st of all we will talk about the decent of beingness into matter (not that it is really actually a decent) earlier i have mentioned how the Conscious Absolute (Para-Brahman) has the potency in it. (Para-Sakti ) and with that lord Siva also.

I have said the Para-Sakti in its pure form is the Icchaa-Sakti of Lord Siva. Let me get a quote for you from the discourse on Who is the Self.

Quote

Will is pure Sakti..... Sakti that has not yet moved or been employed; so it cannot be seen or known. It can only be recognized in itself by the Lord in Himself. Yet there exists a very deep secret about how the lord acts to create it consists in the fact that He does not act at all.

The sheer power of His Will held in check.... causes the Manifestation of the Sakti, which vibrates as the primordial unstruck Pranavam; then the moola-maya appear "AS" that manifestation of His potency (AS A RESULT OF HIS NOT MOVING HIS WILL) this potency is the potential-to-be which appears as the diversity known as His Own Consciousness (we call it TIME). It is Maya, Samsara, knowledge and ignorance. Then there comes the whole of the Cosmic display.

End Quote

At this point the Astral World begins to Appear in the Brahman.

Nisha : Brahman ?

bindu: Para-Brahman is the Nothing --- the Naked reality .... it becomes the Brahman when there is a reference to a selfhood such as Lord Siva the first manifestation is the bindu.... then the beingness of the Conscious One which exists as the Lord splits into countless Jeeva of countless variety, type, species and sub-species along with countless beings within each species such that the Lord has a multifaceted consciousness not only with each species, but also within each species existing as the ever-diversifying genetic and ever-changing psychological states of mind of the number of beings that exist and are coming into existence at a given moment.

In this way the consciousness of the lord is ever gathering more of itself and ever expanding; embracing the necessity for omnipresence and omniscience due to the ever expanding nature of the Consciousness. Through this the lord can be said to be omniscient and omnipresent forever.

Nisha : ok got it

bindu: When the countless Jiva come, there are at the same time countless reflections of consciousness occurring in them as the Jeeva are fragments of consciousness. These fragments, due to the Fact that they are fragments must remain fragmented in order that the beingness come to achieve sentience; it is something like an inverted reflection (a reflection of a reflection).

Now then so that the Jiva comes to consciousness (even though it is an merely an illusion of separation), the mind comes to maintain the fragmentation; with that comes the multiplicity of what are called archetypal realities.

The word Archetypal means: Representing or constituting an original type after which other similar things are patterned

Nisha : Parabrahman = conscious absolute.... Brahman = the self Jiva = living entity.

bindu: yes, perfectly so.

Archetypal realties are reflections of the multiplicity of the beingness of Sri Krishna in his own consciousness. This is where the gods come into being. They are like ever descending less powerful selves of lord Siva; less powerful because with i-ness comes limitation in efficacy.

The Word efficacy is: The Capacity or power to produce a desired effect thus they preside over given areas or existences; this is the nature of the fragmentation. and hence the multitude of Jeeva preside over different aspects of the beingness of Sri Krishna. But Sri Krishna is the Final God.

Nisha : oh

bindu: For example: The further away from base you are, the less your radio can receive of a signal; the signal breaks up and becomes fragmented.

This decent and the manifestation of the Jeeva ... is as i said merely an illusion, but the illusion is maintained by, and as the Maya so that the necessity for knowledge-consciousness of Sri Krishna can exist.

The Conscious Absolute Sri Krishna remains transcendental in this way. Whereas the existence becomes His knowledge of ever expanding and imploding knowledge of His own nature.... this ever fluid and mercurial nature of knowledge-consciousness, is his multi-faceted Cosmic form i.e ParamAtma.

Now we will talk about the individual from a human perspective Jeeva, (<---- plural) can only exist in chaos because in unity consciousness there is realization or harmony -- this means the various lokas, worlds, dimensions, heavens hells etc. must come as well as the Astral worlds so that the fragmentation can remain in existence.

Time, movement, atomic flux and decay---- Life, Death and existence of individual consciousness comes in at this point. because he exists, and has seemed to have fragmented into uncountable Jeeva (i said SEEMED to have fragment) there is then the veil of ignorance as to His true nature appearing as the mind.

This veil of ignorance causes the illusion that there are other beings. when in fact there is only one. For example:

To exist, as what seems to be an individual, He has become an uncountable number of Jeeva.

We will talk now of the individual himself. This is the point at which the Jeeva start to look at themselves in comparison to other Jeeva (<--- plural.)

Nisha : Does this mean that to Krishna his existence is to himself existing through uncountable living entities?

bindu: yes exactly; and yes he experiences countless ways of looking at and through all forms of consciousness.

Thus the Siva sutra says: "He is free in all modes of His own consciousness" he is in this way not limited in any way or mode.
but that is getting off the subject.

Once the Jeeva start to look at themselves in comparison to other Jeeva. Due to the very looking; reflections appear in the Consciousness.

At this point, according to the individual Jiva's acceptance of a given level or mode of consciousness, there will be more or less fragmentation of awareness. The fragments will appear as other worlds or lokas or other beings or entities; archetypal or otherwise (All other beings are also Jeeva). These jeeva will be all beings other than the particular one who is looking.

The jeeva into which The Self has split (due to the looking) appear as an hierarchy which extends from the very lowest being to the highest god (because Sri Krishna is ALL).

As a matter of course, when the mind\consciousness of the Jiva opens a little to this truth (either as the result of trauma or due to some deliberate act); aberrations in the nature of the mind can and do result and\or are created. thus there are different levels of intellect and different types of psychological mind created; this is due to the fact that the moola-maya is seen from the perspective of (or in comparison to) the individual.

So it is the context of the reflection of the consciousness which connotes the nature of the individual. From here the nature of the Astral world which a given individual will experience is effected, or created.

In short the astral experience of a given being is directly effected by his or her decisions about the nature of reality. This means it is nothing more than the reflection in the consciousness of his or her belief system.

For example he or she creates archetypes of what he or she will not or cannot accept. But how can this be? Did i not just say that the Astral world is nothing more than the reflection in the consciousness of his or her belief system?

Yes that is what i said. This seems to be a contradiction, but it is not because because belief does not make the truth true, it merely alters the face of truth to suit the believers idea of reality.

Why did i say the astral or archetypal beings are what he or she will not accept? Remember i said that "ALL" Jeeva are fragments of The Self; i also said they are reflections of The Self in his OWN consciousness.

The answer can be found in the fact that to remain separate from The Self, as a unique individual there is the requisite that certain combinations of the nature The Self, be excluded from the makeup of the individual; while others are integrated WITH and comprise the individual Jeeva. THIS is what results in the myriad forms and natures of the countless Jeeva.

The archetypes which are seen as separate from the Individual Jeeva comprise the astral beings, and the astral plane comes into being as the place in which these beings exist. They are banished to the astral plane if you like to put it simply.

But there is a little more to it than this. The astral plane, even though it seems to come into being as a result of what seems to be rejection of an aspect of ones own being, does not exist BECAUSE of the rejection or acceptance.. the rejection or acceptance is an illusion because there is no Self other than Sri Krishna.

The Astral exists due to what i said above, regarding how the whole of the cosmic display of the lords consciousness (ParaAtma) must exist in what seems to be fragments .. IN ORDER that this and that can be known.

For example: if all things knowable were the same thing there could be no comparisons made... comparisons give the reference to objective knowership. An example of this is that dark cannot be known except in comparison to light; and the so it is with light also... light cannot be known except in comparison to darkness; and there are uncountable numbers of this duality.

Hence knowledge-consciousNESS cannot and could not be known except that the fragmentation "SEEM" to be real when it is not. This too is a duality as you can easily see.

So then in the interests of The Lord being omniscient and omnipresent there seems to be this fragmentation .... hence the astral plane does not exist at all. All that remains is the Transcendental lord; all else is his moola-maya, His plaything; which is existing so that He can know who and what He is ...... but He does not know as we know; He knows who and what He is NOT by or in relation to what He is; (He does not know by comparison as we do) but by and relation to what He is not ....i.e. He is NOT his own moola-maya... which exists in infinite variety. He is beyond it. and hence neti neti; not this not that.

Yet this fragmentation, in the context of the various Jeeva, when it is looked at from the perspective of those Jeeva. connotes a different psychological mind for each Jiva.

Nisha : He is not this and not that ..yet He is this and that?

bindu: Yes.

This conoted different psychological mind, is what is thought to be the soul... it is composed of various layers of experience and is affected by further experience ...these layers of experience are called vasanas.

The Vasanas make up what it called the Akashic Sheath of the individual and thus separate him from the whole of Sri Krishna; hence the Jiva's perception is distorted by his very existence itself. The Jiva cannot thus achieve realization as HE is the actual Vasanas which veil the Truth-Consciousness; whereas Sri Krishna is not composed of Vasanas.

Sri Krishna is the Transcendental Self... The Jeeva are merely Sri Krishna's reflection in The Conscious Absolute.

The countless worlds are the existences into which each jeeva is shown to exist and each world is a reflection of the Abode of the Transcendental Lord; That abode is His OWN Self.

Imagine for a moment if there were not Jeeva; then there would also be no lokas, realms. worlds existences and NO time also; the worlds and lokas come for the Jeeva (for the Archetypes of Sri Krishna); there being none there would be no worlds etc. there could only be Sri Krishna in His own Transcendental Selfhood "unknowable by any means or beingness".

The Astral comes and such also the uncountable Jeeva, which exist as His mulitplicit I-ness. Here His nature has been described in depth. but we will now look upwards from the Jiva mind.

Nisha : unknowable for who ji?

bindu: Only He can know that, it is unspeakable. Incommunicable........ transcendental of all knowledge.

Nisha : ok ji.. transcendental even for language and explanation

bindu: yes

So then looking upward from the Jiva-mind ... as if seen from his point of view by him; due to the fact that as described above there are uncountable permutations of consciousness due to the Vasanas.... the intellect of a given Jiva will only be able to penetrate just so far into the truth .... he or she will not be able to understand all of it.... it will be different for each hence the archetypal realties will be different also and the rejected fragments of The Self will manifest as different astral entities and experiences also.

bindu: do you understand the last sentence?

Nisha : what is Vasanas ji?

bindu: Layers of experience composed of memory and affected by emotion this is why a current experience is effected by the emotions of the previous experience.

Nisha : got it

bindu: So then here is where there levels of psychological stability are founded; and we have countless levels of group experience and awareness. Hence we as beings split into species and groups of selves such as those who like a certain thing and so on. The preferences also of individuals comes in here; the genetics also. and from here you can form your own conclusions and connections yes?

Nisha : sure ji.

bindu: One more thing: the psychological reactions then to the archetypal reality that a given Jiva may experience is then due to his or her own fragmentation or non-acceptance of the beingness...... this is why people who have schizophrenia are almost always god-oriented. thus any reference to godliness or evil and good is a bad idea when dealing with them.

Nisha : hmm

bindu: So then i would think that if a person who has schizophrenic tendencies may hypothetically be helped by getting an understanding of what i have just been speaking about; however, unless he or she has the stability to understand it, it may cause more problems.

Nisha : true.. but perhaps not in a explanatory way.. as u did here.
understanding would be already affected.

bindu: Yes; So it would be a very long process of slow introduction of the things i have outlined here. i really think it would help in the long term.

Nisha : ji how would you define an experience? (talking from a human perspective)

bindu: An experience of?

Nisha : just experience itself.

bindu: well dear .. no experience could possibly be had unless there were an individual, so there is the requirement of and the for Jiva in this context. Now having said this; for the realized, it is a mtter of knowing it is The Self who is experiencing himself.

An experience for a Jiva however, will always be relative as he will compare it to previous experiences or information he has previously heard about what he is experiencing; always putting himself in the picture -seeing himself as part of the experience in combination with the environment. This simply means he sees himself in the "CONTEXT" of the experience. It also means he cannot see himself or know he is having any experience at all, "EXCEPT" and "UNLESS" he puts himself in the picture by imagining he is experiencing the experience. The context in which he sees himself, can only be known in relation to, or comparison to the effect of the environment upon what he refers to as himself.

Nisha : Could it be possible for the Jiva to get in touch with The Real Self.. by looking into the experiences?

bindu: Yes, but not unless he discovers the contextual source yet if sought, all contexts will lead to the source (i.e. The Self).

Due to this if the Jiva looks at himself in the context of the world he will never find The Self. e.g. If he looks at the experience and not its context he will never The self; as there must be an experiencer. Thus the reference to Mtrka (the science of Mantra) in the Sutra is about context.

Nisha : He must seek the experience of the ONE who is same in all contexts?

bindu: Yes.

So then the Jiva must learn not to superimpose what he thinks he is upon the context then he will see the truth. All things you see, appear in the context of The Self because there is simply no other context that is truly existent.

Nisha : what does sutra say?

bindu: This is not word for word, but it talks about how the universe arises from Syllables - from "MANTRA" it goes on to describe in detail how syllables are the beginning of the idea of a certain context. Words come from syllables; then context becomes evident in the word. Yet The Self is beyond words.

Nisha : When one day i find i have changed because of the experiences i had over 2 days.... what does this mean? Does it mean the perception of the Jiva has become clearer... or is The Self perceiving more clearly?

bindu: Both. But referring to your question: "Is The Self perceiving more clearly?"

The Self is not perceiving more clearly, it is a matter of He is revealing more of Himself each day you live.

Nisha : When The Self is perceiving... does this indicate a transformation of The Self?

bindu: Think of it like decay of the illusional layers - of ice melting from a frozen window so that you can see outward more clearly with each passing day.

Nisha : I am asking from an Absolute point of view.. ( as it is indicated that The Self is changeless).

bindu: When we evolve each day, each moment, what we know now in relation to what we knew previously is a different point of view of the same Self. This means He is now looking at a previously existing (but previously hidden) aspect of Himself. It does not mean He has changed. i.e it is just more of His pre-existing knowledge that is now been made evident.

This simply means everything knowable is already existing but not known yet; because with each change of you as you evolve. so does your context change and with it your separation from The Self also dissolves slowly.

Other beings take the place you left a moment ago.. or yesterday, those others are you as you were yesterday; hence the you you are now in comparison to yesterday existed before you knew her. The old you is existing in the past; hence The Self is all throughout all times ALL THE TIME! The same applies for ALL jiva just as it does for you.

Nisha : But the self is beyond Time and Context and is eternal.. so only the senses of perception are evolving and changing and transforming?

bindu: Yes, that gives the knowledge (which exists AS the Consciousness) existence, while the Transcendental Self is every free of knowing and not knowing; hence His knowledge is Transcendental Knowledge.

Nisha : Yes ji. So The Self is not in the process of becoming.. it is already is.. but only the senses. The senses are in the process of being purified?

bindu: No no. the consciousNESS is in the process or act of being conscious. with each experience the consciousness becomes more conscious. This gives the variety of awareness and understanding that is the nature of the consciousness.

Nisha : yes ji.. not The Self.. but it's consciousNESS

bindu: Yes, exactly.

This world ... the cosmos... "IS THE CONSCIOUSNESS" but The Self is prior to and beyond it; hence He is transcendental.

Nisha : So The Self is eternal and pure.. but it's consciousNESS of it's self is in the process of becoming.. and transforming.. and changing

bindu: Yes, that is right. That is why i say use the term "Conscious Absolute" instead of saying "The Absolute ConsciousNESS".

Nisha : okie got it

bindu: This is truth nishu.

Nisha : Yes, it is The Absolute Truth. But one more thing ji..

bindu: Yes?

Nisha : It also means this Absolute Truth can be reflected in the consciousNESS and in Jiva's experiences. Yet even though it exist in a fragmented way, it is existing in all these relationships.

bindu: Yes, thus you have the guru principal. But the guru knows what is reflected is a reflection only. However we must not miss the fact that the relationships and the moola-maya are in continous change and flux.

Nisha : jai jai. yes these this is a great piece of information.. which transcends the information its self.

Let me explain in my own words what i understand moola maya to be.

bindu: ok

Nisha : Moola maya is the lords potency which is inferior to his superior spiritual nature.. It is also called the material nature which is in continuous change and flux. Even though it is eternal, its manifestation is temporary

bindu: Yes, that is precisely correct. You have learned it well Devi. __/|\__

Nisha : Thank you very much for making things clear to me

bindu: with all my heart you are welcome

Nisha : This is great... i cannot thank you enough for your time and this great knowledge you have shared with me. Thank you so much

bindu: i will put this discourse on the Ananta Archive in a few days

Take note devi: Last of all - how the individual mind gets deluded by the context and the fragmentation and is for that reason insane ..... no matter how sane it appears... thus there are countless levels of sanity also. Hence only the realized ones are truly sane. Let this be the end of the file.